Religions of the World
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Iran and France Both Want to Control a Woman's Dress

An Iranian cleric made headlines and set off a boobquake when he recently claimed immodest dress causes earthquakes. Now, Tehran's police chief is taking on this "threat" by arresting "suntanned" women. The chief explained:

"The public expects us to act firmly and swiftly if we see any social misbehaviour by women, and men, who defy our Islamic values. In some areas of north Tehran we can see many suntanned women and young girls who look like walking mannequins."

Hm. A national crackdown on a type of female appearance sounds familiar. Which brings us to France.

Just like in Iran, French leaders worry that a certain type of dress — namely the Islamic burqa and niqab — threatens the country's "values." Despite warnings that a ban would violate France's constitution, President Sarkozy is moving forward with a law that would prohibit women from wearing these Islamic veils in public. Those in favor of it, such as the country's immigration ministers, say face-covering veils "run counter to national values." Supporters say the law would help prevent the subjugation of women, something France cannot stand for, although opponents say it would further isolate some Islamic women.

The two laws certainly have their differences, but wouldn't a law telling women what they can and cannot wear bring France's national values closers to the values of Iran?

postmodernsleaze postmodernsleaze 6 years 3 weeks
Let's also face it that there's a big difference between extremists and other Muslims. Just like there are extremist Christian sects and everyday Christians that do not take their beliefs so far. For example, I've seen some Mormon women in Utah that are pretty much a face-mask away from a full burqa. Banning a certain type of dress for Muslim women is not going to affect fundamentalist extremism, in my opinion. I just think France's ban is an ineffective way to go about ridding the world of Dark Ages-esque religious extremism.
chloe-bella chloe-bella 6 years 3 weeks
^^^Too bad America has multiple constitutional provisions barring such a law.
lilashleyxox lilashleyxox 6 years 3 weeks
I'm probably going to get attacked for saying this but this kind of makes me want to move to France. France has a serious problem with muslims taking over their country. And its not about letting women choose what to wear, because the muslims don't have a say, the men choose that they wear that. And as a side note I think that it wouldn't be a bad thing if America did this too, if it stops the muslims from moving to France, then America def should.
postmodernsleaze postmodernsleaze 6 years 3 weeks
I completely understand where France is coming from, but I'm not sure banning this type of dress is the best solution. I agree with hypnotic that it kind of seems counteractive. And I agree with chloe bella that it is infringing on the rights of women to ban the kind of dress if a woman in France happens to choose it. And it's true that there is, and has been, A LOT of tension between French citizens and the Algerian population in France and that this ban does seem motivated by racism rather than women's rights. I do understand both sides, but I lean much more on the side of not supporting the ban.
sourcherries sourcherries 6 years 3 weeks
I'm with spacekatgal--torn. On one hand, freedom to dress according one's beliefs is a right. On the other, when members--extreme and fringe, to be sure, but still members--of that religion appropriate dress to carry out suicide attacks...I can understand being jittery about allowing/not regulating that kind of dress.
chloe-bella chloe-bella 6 years 3 weeks
There has historically been a lot of tension between France's Muslim population and "native" French citizens. My feeling is that they're hoping this law will make the Muslims move somewhere else.
chloe-bella chloe-bella 6 years 3 weeks
I don't support the ban. What if someone wanted to wear this as part of a costume? The ban in that instance would operate to censor political speech, not to protect women. This would be unconstitutional for so many reasons in the US. Also, I think it's ultimately motivated by racism, not by a desire to protect women.
Grandpa Grandpa 6 years 3 weeks
France has the largest Muslim population of all EU countries, The Muslim women that wear burqa in France are not all that far from The women in a country like Iran, where there are historically strong secular movements, but they only have safe those rights the Ayatollah gives them. Where does a Muslim woman raised in seclusion, with no job skills, no non-Muslim acquaintances, let alone friends go in France? How does she get there?
hypnoticmix hypnoticmix 6 years 3 weeks
Oh I understand all of that grandpa which is why it makes more sense to hear of such a mandate from such a country and unusual coming from France.
Grandpa Grandpa 6 years 3 weeks
Hypno, the women in countries like Iran and Saudi Arabia, have no rights and no say as to what they can and can not do with their lives. There is very little difference between women raised in such an environment and those raised in slavery. The owner/masters have the law and the culture on their side. They decide who is going to get an education, and what that education will entail. Like the slave, she has very little recourse, and no real "safe haven" to flee to, except at risk of serious bodily harm or even death. The slightest hint of 'rebellion" whether by word, tone of voice, or facial expression can lead to the most brutal retaliation.
totygoliguez totygoliguez 6 years 3 weeks
You shouldn't, but that is the way it is. If religious attired are used by terrorist groups, then governments should take measurements to protect their citizens. I'm not saying is fair, but I know where they are coming from. This attired makes them unidentifiable; therefor, easy for the few bad people to leave a weapon and just leave and none will ever know who it was. And yes, terrorist groups can use a million methods to terrorize people, but using Islamic women because their attired makes them unidentifiable will not be one of them. Is this fair? No. But sometimes you will have to do unfair things to protect the citizens of your state. It is clear that their is not only ONE terrorist out there and that they are using more women now, look at what happened in Russia a month ago, it was done by a women.
totygoliguez totygoliguez 6 years 3 weeks
I understand where France is coming from. Unfortunately, terrorist groups are using Muslim women for terrorist practices, and it is hard for surveillance cameras or citizens to identify these women. What if a terrorist women decides to leave a terrorist weapon in a highly popular place, lets say the Ifel Tower, how would they be able to identify her if she is all cover up?
hypnoticmix hypnoticmix 6 years 3 weeks
Iran is a church state at least their mandate is in correspondence with their form of government. France on the other hand is misguided. Women in France should have the freedom not to wear and know that there is amnesty available to them if they make the personal choice to rebel against their church and or family but to ban them is an overstep IMO. What about the women who embrace their religion and embrace wearing them? Now you're stepping on their rights.
Grandpa Grandpa 6 years 3 weeks
I must stress here, while i consider myself somewhat knowledgeable, i am in no way authoritative in my understanding of the Qu'ran. having said that I know of NOTHING that requires women to wear a burqa. I am sorry, in this day and age, anything that does not allow the full participation in society of any group based on gender, race, religion, national origin is wrong and should be an anathema to any right thinking moral person in today's society. It wasn't all that time ago in history that women had no rights political, inheritance, legal rights in the west. Finding excuses for such perversions in the fundamentalist interpretation of Islam, is political correctness gone amuck at best, and political cowardliness in fact.
tlsgirl tlsgirl 6 years 3 weeks
I'm with SKG on this - I'm really torn.